Is Ubuntu Family Friendly?
Yesterday while I was browsing Ubuntu Forums I came across a thread posted by someone named EssexJames. He recounts a recent experience with showing his 10 year old son Ubuntu:
I enjoyed setting up Ubuntu 8.10 with my 10 year old son. We learned about Ubuntu together and I was pleased that he was really engaged and interested in the whole process of installation and the philosophy of Ubuntu.
We looked at the various packages that can be installed – to see if there was anything that looked really interesting. We got some graphics and video applications. All excellent.
Then we hit a snag. “Daddy, what’s Brainf**k?” he said. (This is the name of one of the packages).
Can I ask the community that develops Ubuntu and those that compile distributions, to please bear in mind that computers are family devices.
This forum’s terms and conditions state “…you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar…”. It’s a great shame that the development community don’t apply similar rules.
He continues in a follow up post:
If the objective of Ubuntu and other Linux distributions is to provide an operating system which people can use to replace Microsoft software, then it will need to tidy up the use of profanities in the code and application names. Families with children will see these things, decide it’s not for them, pay the devil and go to Microsoft instead.
I’ll happily f and blind with the best of them, but don’t expect profanities to appear on-screen when installing operating system software.
I wanted my son to become enthused by Linux and to learn about it himself. I install filters for web browsing for him – but I didn’t think I’d need one for an operating system and its components.
There have been several good replies to these two posts that I wanted share with you. Indeed, it would be rather awkward for any parent who is showing their child a free OS and then discover within the package manager (which organizes over 26,000 different individual programs/dependencies and actually requires you to type in an administrator password before it can even be looked at) an uttering of profanity. Here’s what some members of the Ubuntu community had to say in response to this:
From “steveneddy”:
I suggest that you explain it to him politely and professionally and if it bothers you, don’t mention it to him again.
All children are going to learn these words eventually.
This is a good time to wear the Daddy hat and sit down with the little tyke and have a man to man talk.
I also raised my two daughters, now 20 and 23, and have my two grandchildren here living with me.
We just have to decide that when that day arrives, and it will, that we are man enough to explain things like this to them in an adult manner so that they understand why it is that way and why some of us choose not to use those types of words around our children.
Don’t think worse of the whole community just because of the lapse in judgment of one developer.
From “starcannon”:
It is best to preview any material that you wish to expose your children to. It would be wrong to drop software simply because someone does not like the name. I would say that if freedom of speech and all of its implications are not something your prepared to deal with, perhaps some other OS is appropriate for your situation; I think Ubuntu is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I have 2 daughters, one is 11 and the other is 12, I do not see that they have been damaged at all by the occasional exposure to a slang word in the package manager, they hear much worse on the school bus; and then there is popular media such as television, movies, and music, all 3 of which have much more offensive words and ideas than a satirically named and obscure [programming] language.
There is plenty of xxx software for MS Windows, arguably much more than for any other OS, the difference is that when one searches for software for windows they may use the google search engine, when one searches for software for Ubuntu they use the Synaptic search engine; ironic isn’t it that if one runs across the “F” word on google while looking for windows software, that is acceptable; if however, one runs across it on the Synaptic search engine it is not acceptable. Ultimately I don’t care what a package is named, I care what the package does, indeed I never even knew about BF until you posted about it, /shrug, and again, it is your responsibility as a parent to do the parenting, not Microsoft’s, not Canonical’s, not Linux’s, not GNU’s, not Apple’s. Accept responsibility or don’t either way I certainly hope that package availability is never based on psuedo puritan ideals that have not even come close to actually existing in over 125 years.
“Grant A”, complimenting starcannon adds:
You are 100% correct. People say they are getting their kids ready for the real world, and THIS is the result. V-Chips, and their kin have made parents very lazy and thus devaluing the social standards the U.S. once held. Life has cuss words, believe it or not your children WILL hear these words. It is up to YOU to teach your child what it means. And no matter what you do, you can train him, you can stick a shock collar on him (please don’t) he WILL still say cuss words, or think them. I know a preacher who is a profane cusser. I am very offended that you want to step upon my rights to FREE speech as declared in over 200 countries, I do not tolerate fascism.
I am aware that this post may have sounded derogatory, but it wasn’t. Sometimes the blunt truth is the best truth. I’m not going to sugar coat everything I say on the Internet. I tried to keep this as civil as possible and avoided all the flaming I wanted to do. Please teach your children yourself, who else will? The Internet is not your baby sitter. If you don’t want your kid to see cuss words, you might as well have left him illiterate.
I agree with all of what was said in the above responses. It ultimately falls on the parent to do the parenting of their child. Grant A’s mentioning of the V-Chip, I think, is a good example of how some parents try to use technology to avoid awkward conversations with their child about things like sex, violence, drugs and “adult” language. That being said, it should be emphasized that the Internet itself is a far more profane place than a simple package manager ever could be. Slightly off topic, I think to call any computer which is attached to the Internet a “family device” is a contradiction, no matter what operating system you choose to use.
EssexJames has marked his thread as “Solved” since posting it yesterday, but he’s not posted any kind of followup to indicate exactly what the replies have solved for him. So I sent him a private message asking him what he’s decided and he says, although little can be quickly done to enable a profanity filter in Synaptic (and possibly won’t be implimented quickly because of resistance/misunderstandings), he and his son will continue to use Ubuntu. He added that he will also start keeping a closer eye on him and his computer activities. Good job, dad!
November 24th, 2008 at 7:49 pm
This is not nearly as bad as some Linux distributions shipping with the “webcollage” screensaver, which is part of the xscreensaver package. Webcollage pulls random pictures from the Internet and displays them in a collage, but it often ends up pulling in some very inappropriate images. Fortunately, Ubuntu doesn’t install this by default, and there is a warning in the package info when trying to install the xscreensaver-data-extra package, which includes WebCollage.
November 24th, 2008 at 11:04 pm
I used to have that screensaver!
November 25th, 2008 at 1:42 am
For fuck’s sake!
November 25th, 2008 at 9:23 am
For crying out loud, there is always one of those.
“Will someone please think about the childeren!”
No, we don’t care.
My baby brother is 10 years old, and I can tell you, I don’t have to explain what a certain cuss word means. He already knows it, and uses it.
Stop over protecting your children, idiot.
November 26th, 2008 at 8:51 pm
I’m all for free speech and I’ve never advocated censorship; however, I don’t see that as the issue in this case. The blatant disregard for other peoples’ feelings in modern society is shameful. Society used to have much higher standards than this and in some cases (becoming more rare) it still does. I had college professors and even high school teachers who wouldn’t think twice about injecting a vulgar term into a lecture, but a kindergarden teacher who habitually swears in class is likely to have problems finding employment sooner than later. There is a time and place for all types of language, and perhaps this was a poor choice.
November 27th, 2008 at 12:48 am
Is Ubuntu Family Friendly? I fucking hope not.
November 27th, 2008 at 2:43 am
Someone had to try to make this a freedom of speech question! I can understand teen agers testing their boundaries by using cusswords everywhere, but that normally drops when they grow up.
November 27th, 2008 at 7:49 am
I called my dad a fucking bitch when I was 6 years old. He washed my mouth out with soap.
I fear for the next kid that stumbles across this package and decides it would be amusing to call his father a brainfuck…. rename the package now please.
November 27th, 2008 at 9:28 am
brandon, i fully agree.
as for it being unavoidable that kids will learn cusswords, well, that’s just
plain false. in my family noone uses such words, so i have grown up without
them an don’t use them either. and the only way to keep it that way is to not
listen to people who keep using them.
greetings, eMBee.
November 27th, 2008 at 3:49 pm
There is a segment of the Linux community that is alternative to the core. You will find names like PornView for a program that views pictures and movies. Somebody thought it funny once. You can’t legislate good taste or filter out the world and that goes with Linux, Windows or anything else.
The lesson to be learned here was Dad’s not the son’s. He has to recognize that you can’t keep out the bad no matter how hard you try. What you can do is educate your child so that he recognizes that we don’t all share the same values or sense of humour. The biggest mistake that he can make is to censor or make it into a big issue. This will only garner more attention than it deserves and make the child want to taste the forbidden fruit.
Dad cannot change the Linux community any more than he can change the world. Each is headed in its own direction. He can change the way his child learns to view the world and Linux by how the father reacts to it. The world should not be shunned in its entirety because we don’t like elements of it, nor should Linux. Dad must grow up first before the son can follow his lead.
December 1st, 2008 at 2:47 pm
I suppose one way to ensure that you do not encounter anything offensive in terms of package names, at least without a Parental Advisory sticker, is to stick with proprietary software. Something about corporate image and appealing to the masses adds a layer of protection. Oh, the price of freedom!
December 8th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
Well, after reading the posts. I am shocked to the at what some of the members of the ubuntu community had to say. I do,like the watchful parent, would like ubuntu to be family friendly actually what I typed in “is ubuntu child friendly” to get to this website. Something that is used to educate should have a personal obligation to not misguide anyone. We expose our children to so much corruption and then when they make errs, we don’t understand why. A child is like a little program itself, eventhough you may explain these things to them and tell them that they are not right, sometimes it’s too late. The difference between a child and a computer is that you can delete programs from a computer but with a child depending on what area of life this new concept was introduced, it’s wired in. The child doesn’t erase the event, they function with it and you don’t know what turn it will take. I feel a system that I am entrusting my kids to use bare some responsibility to the users’ expectations of the content. Freedom of speech was not introduced for those who wanted to say foul and corrupt things-it was introduced so those who were treated unfairly and unjust could stand up and have a voice. Please don’t belittle that right.
December 9th, 2008 at 8:05 pm
@amitch:
I would suggest you send an IM to the person who started the original thread and ask them why they’ve decided to continue using Ubuntu with their 10 year old son and what has changed for them since this incident came up. Obviously they were concerned about profanity being found within the package manager (which, as I stated in my blog, requires the user to enter an administrator password to gain access to…. something a child should probably not be given with ANY operating system). So what changed their mind? Because at first he felt that he might have to “pay the devil” and go back to Microsoft as a last minute resort, short of finding another version of Linux to try. You really should ask them. They may change your mind.
I personally don’t care what operating system you use. And I think that same sentiment holds true for everyone else in the open-source community; it’s entirely up to you. The way you raise your kids is also ENTIRELY up to you (not me or anyone else). I’m not a parent, but I would see nothing wrong with limiting access to the computer to times when you’re available to supervise them yourself. If you’re not available, you might as well not allow them to use it in the first place… that is, if you feel they’re not mature enough to handle it without guidance. Operating systems aside, you can only shelter your child from the bad things in the real world for so long. If you do it too much, they may find themselves unprepared to face it alone when they’re older. I don’t know about you, but I’ve known people in their 40’s and 50’s who still live with their parents for this very reason. That is not to say that Ubuntu is a bad thing. I think it’s a wonderful thing on the order of cosmic proportions. That’s just my opinion; someone else might consider it the work of the devil because someone found a naughty word (there are naughty words in the bible; see Ezekiel 23:19-20).
If I were you, I wouldn’t let a fluke appearance of the f-word in an applet that requires administrator access (YOUR password, not the child’s password) ruin your day, or go off on some quest to find some other OS that is potentially less functional or less user friendly or less secure or less free. If you’re a Windows user and you’re happy with it, then stick with it. But considering the fact that you took Ubuntu into consideration says to me that whatever you’re using, you are not happy with it. So it sounds like you have some pros and cons to weigh, just like the father of the 10 year old boy did, and he decided to stick with Ubuntu in the end. You may find yourself feeling the same way later on (Windows viruses are getting a lot worse, I’ve seen first hand in the last 3 weeks).